Lines For Penny Wong (1)

Tony Abbott has already enforced the fundamentalist Catholic line on gay marriage. Why will he not enforce the fundamentalist Catholic line on abortion?

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  1. If you observe the US, the pattern is for constant petty harassment and outrage inducement backgrounded by tabloid “noise”, followed by incremental erosion of a set of laws, even if by clause by clause over a long time.
    The right hope that eventually public opinion will turn and they can eliminate it.
    I doubt whether Abbott will attempt a frontal assault, but there will be a grating, anxiety-inducing campaign intent on discreditation and engineered consent and the removal of vulnerable pieces of the laws.
    I doubt whether well organised feminism and its progressive allies will permit a direct roll back, fertility is a personal issue.
    All in all, part of the Hobbesian War on Women, humanity in general and Talibanisation/Greensboro-isation of Western culture, except that the ideology so lacks credibility.

  2. wouldabeenthespian

    Perhaps former Father, Kevin Lee can help explain:

    Today’s online edition of the SMH has at least 5 articles pointing to an undoing of Abbott’s Agenda ..

    • A very fascinating story. It has a hellava lot in it, not least being how on earth could there be such detailed backstabbing and character assassinations bothered with over a pre-selection for seats like McMahon and Fowler where the candidates were, until the Rudd/Gillard destabilisation, like fighting for opposition to the sitting party members of Batman or Berowra. They seem to be the province of 20-something wannabees normally.

      That aside, the religious factor in the dysfunctional (and incompetent) NSW Libs organisation is well known in this state and I gave my opinion of this in the recent Alex Hawke ‘debate’ about Abbott’s parental leave scheme. One of the terrible things about these two parties is this sort of stuff, and to read this (even if it was a safe seat where most of this would go on I suspect its not shock to anyone who knows how these parties work. A bit like the former Mark Latham area of Sydney, Liverpool and surrounds, where even at local government level these are fought over quite ruthlessly (the Craig Knowles family had a virtual pocket borough out there supposedly) although all councillors deliver ‘things’ to people, but an almost certain pre-ordained failure in a federal seat? Who would have thought it?

      Anyway, two things stand out from close to the beginning of the story, Bill Heffernan, if nothing else, just comes out looking like….well…Bill Heffernan and not a villain by any means (in the context of how the major political parties go about this). And the ex-priest Kevin Lee is like all of them, prepared to do what they do and just as stupid to go for McMahon or Fowler. And while I don’t object to any religious types believing whatever they want to believe (as long as they don’t want to make it compulsory or kill me because I am NOT one of their followers) and thus the UFO people and the Catholics can get on with it, but they shouldn’t get a pass on taxes that everyone else pays and they should be out of politics.

      Then the religious side and opus dei leaves me cold, being an atheist since early teens, not a lapsed catholic like so many critics. All my life I have come across that clannishness, and while I have not knowingly had anything to do with opus dei, I have had plenty of insights into the similar influence of the masons, or religious sub-groups such as the Catholic ones like the Knights of the Southern Cross (and I even had a colleague who was in both the Lodge AND the Knights – covering the personal and job boosts from both sides as it were). Going by the comments from the link, I wondered how many there were who were Dan Brown devotees though.

  3. Well maybe Abbott and Cardboard Pell can answer this for me?

    ”If we accept we did not exist before birth, why can’t we accept we will not exist after death?”

    • but they probably wouldn’t accept anything as sensible as your premise

      Some bloke two and a half thousand years ago put these words in god’s mouth “Before I formed you in the womb I knew you, and before you were born I consecrated you; I appointed you a prophet to the nations.”

      That’s why the 80pc natural rate of spontaneous abortions of all fertilised human eggs is such a source of sadness for the fundies of America (I suppose)

  4. Well, obviously, he will.
    As I suspect, Bob, you well know. Religious fundamentalists really believe the crap they spout.
    He will just go about it in a mealy mouthed, weasel worded manner.
    As tory politicians go about a good deal of their business.
    It doesn’t matter in the grand scheme of things. What is important is to hold onto ethics, beliefs and fight to the end.
    BTW, the end, in this instance, never comes about.
    Just keep at it.
    We have been in worse places than this, comrade.

  5. Lines For Anyone Who Wants To Shout Them From The Rooftop:

    Telstra declares its Copper Network Ratshit!
    Coalition Broadband Cost just blew out by a factor of 4.
    That’s a couple of dollars over 120 Billion.
    That’s right folks - $120 BILLION.
    And that’s EXCLUDING ongoing repair and maintenance!!!

    Rytuin if you’re reading, and of course you are :lol: , that’s what is commonly referred to as one mighty CLUSTERFUCK of a policy!!! :lol: :lol:

    It kinda makes Labor’s NBN and Gonski look as certain and considered as Newtons laws of motion.
    Don’t ya reckon???

    OOOOh its Sweet, how sweet it is….. :cool:

    • I WAS reading this thread but because of the fascinating story of the ex-priest.

      A more measured response to you requires this I think (feel free to give me the latest news though).

      My opinion? I don’t know, do you?

      In any case, even this article doesn’t address the recent comments about Telstra trying to set up value for an Abbott buy-back of the copper for which it already received $11 Billion from the Gillard government etc.

      Then again, any government has means by which they can convince certain corporations which operate under its regulatory regimes to see a fair deal and as a non-corporation person I can se that there is a fair argument that if you have been paid to actually rip up copper, that you have been compensated in full. I don’t know how Telstra will react though. As a victim of Telstra bastardry over many years I don’t have much faith in them to do the right thing anyway.

      I am just waiting to see if there are any new comments coming from Telstra about it, but that is the last reference I actually have seen (not that I have been looking at all)

      • Oh I see, the unions have announced that it is finished. Well I never.

        Who would have thought it eh?

        • Oh, I see the Telco CEO has announced that its gonna last another 100 years. Well never!

          Who would have thought it, eh?

          and so close to a Copper/Node Liberal election win too!

          I”m surprised!

        • Oopps, almost forgot to mention. silly me
          the Liberals haven’t finalised the FINAL price of the copper buy from Telstra.
          I suppose that’s why they haven’t included it in their costings, their press release, their policy document or their projections.

          Hmmm, if I was a cynic I’d say that with thodey’ s comments yesterday the stakes just got a little bit higher.

          Lucky I’m not a cynic. how about you Ryutin? Are you a cynic? we all know you are about Labor, but what about this fucking mongrel policy in front of you now?
          How’s it looking to you?

          Just remember from now till Sept were ONLY going to talk POLICY.

          speaking of which, do you know what the final cost of the Telstra copper is going to be?
          You don’t?
          No worries, just get back to me when it reaches the hundred billion dollar stage.

          Makes the NBN, the BER, Gonski look like a bag of $2 lollies doesn’t it?

          sweet lollies, sweet, sweet lollies.

      • I noticed in a response to Chris hunter on another thread you appreciated the value of on the spot experience. Well here’s one for you.
        I had a Telstra guy over last week to look at my line. He lifted my outside pit and replaced some disgusting old electrical tape with some new stuff. It was yellow and looked just like the stuff I buy from Bunnings, a roll of 10 for $4. We then walked across the road to where another pit was. He lifted the concrete lid and we looked inside. I said to him, fucking hell Dave, what the fuck is that? I pointed to a mangled half of a plastic coke bottle. It was full of wires and bits and holders and all kinds of electrical stuff. Dave just looked and said , oh, that’s just for waterproofing, it holds everything together.
        I laughed in disgust and all he said was, that’s just Telstra mate, smiling.

        Offering Thodey up as a measured response is an insult and an indication of the CLUSTERFUCK I mentioned earlier. Here’s your chance to show your impartiality Ryutin, what’s stopping you?

        A telco CEO says everything’s sweet on the eve of the liberals victory?!?! A telco CEO says everything’s sweet on the eve of realising more money than he’s ever imagined in his life just on MAINTENANCE ALONE?!?!?

        Come on Ryutin, not even YOU can be that stupid, gullible, naive and biased!

        Or can you?

        By the way, I appreciate you NOT responding to our earlier conversation regarding Gonski. Your silence was all the confirmation I needed.

        • I have said it before. Half pure cynic and half pure idealist. Not “a Believer” like you seem to be. And, while I appreciate my apparent worth as a ready-made de-stressor for some of the posters, I don’t feel that the blog should be ruined by any of the obsessionists – just take a look at the great example of the landline/mobile post recently. Nah. Couldn’t be bothered and especially when Gonski ‘chats’ don’t involve Gonski, why bother at all. Anyway, I am pleased that you could take something from it. Feel better, that sort of thing. I don’t want to take part in flame wars if I can get out of it, they ruin a blog.

          As for the rest of it, I actually agree with you on something, you must not take on face value what vested interests tell you (that’s why I said “I don’t know”, although experience should tell you that it’s like the curate’s egg. In any case how big “the parts” are is for experts to decide). Where we seem to differ is that I apply it to vested interests from both sides. That means political vested interests including the rich boys and other elites wanting ordinary taxpayers shelling out for what they will never use themselves.

          The only other point seems to be what to make of anecdotal evidence. You should never generalise from the particular unless there is reason to see general applicability. Chris Hunter’s example exactly matched my own experience of far-flung small communities, some even smaller than the ones he mentions. Add to that was the world educational research (backed by the Real Gonski) that all those points (other than money which is required in double the amounts announced) are of vital importance. That was merely confirmed by actual evidence on the ground. Now if your “example” is followed by some evidence that copper-wired phones are conking out all over the country I will look at it again. Now I am no friend of Telstra and bad work by them would be nothing new, but until real experts talk (or those phones go out all over the place like the lights of Europe) you should be in the same “don’t know” situation as I am. I just suspect that we might have heard of it before now, that’s all.

          • Sorry Ryutin, you’re just not credible. Even this post here, full of condescending ‘advice’ and ‘wisdom’ tells me all I need to know about you.
            Staring you in the face is an unambiguous example of what you called before when attacking labor, policy on the run, and you don’t say a word. Not a fucking word, just generalities and platitudes.
            That’s what makes YOU one of the obsessionists, thats what makes you say you can’t be bothered talking about Gonski without mentioning Gonski as if the name itself will help the school kids, its what makes you value YOUR ‘anecdotes’ but not mine or Telstra Dave’s.
            The reason why I’m not in the ‘I don’t know ‘ camp on this liberal broadband issue is because its shite, shite in conception, shite in costing, shite in its reliance on copper, shite in its deceit,

            You should be too. The fact that your not is ALL the evidence I need to KNOW about your hardcore partisan politics. No different to mine, its just that you don’t admit it and as phill mentioned that’s what I find both disgusting and cowardly.

          • Forgot to mention - on a more serious note: here is an example of liberal policy under serious attack. What ever way you look at it, it stinks - thodey’s comments only confirm that. It was on the front page yesterday for half a day, it was Sunday after all. And today it’s gone. Gone. This is what’s called Abbott’s free ride. Any sort of intelligent sustained attack on POLICY would see the Liberals down to mid 30’s.
            the media have gifted this election to him. Despite the animosity that people feel toward Gillard, despite the lies told over the past 2 years, this election was winnable on POLICY alone. Labor, for all of their own policy problems, still make the liberals look like kids in a sandpit.
            But no one knows about it because big stories like this one are removed from view, airbrushed out, in the space of a wet weekend.

            It’s a sad way for labor to lose and its a disgusting and deceitful way for Abbott to win.

            • And now I read, front page, that labor has dropped a further point.
              Labor”s alleged woes, front page.
              liberal legitimate woes, gone.
              Never to be seen of, or heard of, again.

              Come on Ryutin, you’re a self proclaimed cynicism/realist, what do you make of this mockery?

      • Obviously the bloke from Telstra has never heard of Copper Oxide! On talkback radio a few months, back a technician phoned in and said the copper wire system is fooked. He went on to say that most of the joins he has seen have not even been repaired properly….just tied in a knot and the sand filled in. I go for the technician’s story coz he is “on the ground”. The Telstra CEO in his lofty corporate box, wld never get his hands dirty!!

        • 10 or 15 years ago Telstra said its copper was at “5 minutes to midnight’.

          I’m with you wombat, I’ll believe that half bottle of coke I saw over thodey’s lies any day.

  6. Ryutin never fails to disappoint.

    But this time he did put a rider He did say in (My opinion?)

    So the CEO Mr Thoday reckons copper doesn’t, what were his words? Oh yes decompose.

    Fancy word that, decompose! What a load of unmitigated twaddle. However it does corrode to the point of being totally useless. Copper pipes rupture all over Australia everyday where drainage is a problem. But I wouldn’t fucking know being a plumber.

    I am also Ryutin you’ll love this I am a qualified radio ham. Breaker breaker! Ten four good buddy.

    As soon as copper telephone cables become water logged they are best part useless. The noise from the voltage escaping to earth through the insulation that is damaged by white ants rodents and other damage, makes it unserviceable, it has to be replaced. In some cases water can capillary through it for up to 500 metres. In some suburbs this becomes a full time job.

    The reason Telstra is about as useful as tits on a fucking bull pig, is because they sacked hundreds of their staff involved in maintenance. Yea Ryutin I do know, my brother works for them.

    Abbott and his coterie of Baboons called the opposition, should stick to pulling two cans apart with a tight wet string. That is about the level of their collective expertise on communications.

    • Decompose!!!!!!
      :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:

      Jeeeez Phill, where the fuck do these maggots come from?????

      • I don’t know Judd I’m fucked if I know, I really do.

        I mean you have to laugh, people like Ryutin thinks we that’s us caring sharing lefties, were born about, oh I don’t know, about last Sunday.

        I really do wonder if the Ryutins of the world, really do ponder the fact that most writers of any worth, poets, musicians, entertainers, philosophers and the rest of the good people notwithstanding Ryutin will wax lyrically about Mao, Stalin, or any other so called left wing homicidal maniac, in the world most by an order of magnitude, are all of the left bent.

        OTOH we have bankers, lawyers ceo’s and other assorted thieves and media barons who, control what we read are in the main, rancid right wingers.

        As Julius Sumner Miller would say. Why is it so?

    • Keep up the good work Phill. But remember you have a big week ahead.

    • And I admire your versatility Phill. I have learned something whenever you post. Seagoing ships and the docks need plumbers too, after all. And the ham. As I said, have a good week. It will soon be all over one way or the other.

      • That’s good Ryutin versatility is the word. OBTW Ryutin my other brother although having sold his farm, but I did pick fruit there a few times.

        I guess for you it’s grapes No?

  7. .
    Mirror on the Wall : A bit wet today Tony?

    Face in the mirror : Hmmmph.

    Mirror : What’s up, did Joe mention trying to count again?

    Face : Don’t be too funny. Its the election. I don’t arr think I can hold it all together more than a few more weeks, and its months away still.

    Mirror : Eh? Aren’t the polls good?

    Face : Yeah but we all know they’re cooked and skewed.

    Mirror : But surely Labor have to panic soon, and restore Rudd?

    Face : They might not! Then what will we do? Our whole campaign is set to go.

    Mirror : You could try releasing policies.

    Face : They won’t let me. All I want to do is Stop the Boats Stop the NBN Stop the Schools Stop the Boats . . .

    Mirror : (interrupting) Tony! Stop it!

    Face : arr, whats that - Stop what?

    Mirror : Three word slogans are not policies.

    Face : Since when?

    Mirror : (I wonder if Malcolm needs another mirror; there must be a space on one of his walls??)

  8. Good question Bob but, errr.. coupla three points. The Finance Minister is a Senator and cannot direct questions to the LotO in the Reps.
    Also, apart from not being her Portfolio, Sen. Wong is highly unlikely, by choice, to have been or become gravid.
    Perhaps one on the distaff side in the other Chamber might use your mordant musings?

    • the Senator’s gender or childbearing inclinations are not relevant. I guess Ellis offered her the question because of her interest in Abbs’ attacks on her daughter’s right to have her parents’ union recognised equally with others

      ‘‘I do not regret that our daughter has Sophie and I as parents,’’ Senator Wong said.

      ‘‘I do regret that she lives in a world where some will tell her that her family is not normal. I regret that even in this chamber, elected representatives denigrate the worth of her family. I will not rest in the face of such prejudice. I want for her, for all of us, an Australia which is inclusive and respectful, and this is why this campaign will not end here.’’

    • Who said she should say it in the House, or Senate?

      I would have thought on Q&A.

      • Why Wong and why in a public forum without even the minimal rules of decorum? What would be the chances of her NOT be Heffernanned or worse?
        It’s a valid question and the last thing needed would be the red herrings inside trojan horses which the tory scum would shovel out.

  9. Gough’s quip :

    Gough was giving a speech in public and a heckler kept interjecting, demanding Gough declare his position on abortion. Gough ignored him the first few times, then raised himself to his full height, fixed him with a firm eye and said: ‘Let me make quite clear that I am for abortion and, in your case Sir, we should make it retrospective!’

    There is a good case to be made for it; the occasional catallaxy troll flaming here would be a good start.

  10. Stewart Precians

    Abbott will not be able to roll back abortion simply because it has such widespread support including amongst Liberals and their voters. He can push the so-called Catholic conservative view on gay marriage because this view is supported by a lot of non-Catholics including agnostics and atheists. Hardly comparable.

    • Not roll back abortion - of course not, but . . .

      Abbs is quite capable of making things difficult and unpleasant, especially for poor people - as usual the core Lib voters will be able to look after themselves

      That after all is the attraction of Lib policies, they leave the poor to sink, they leave poor kids to have secondrate education for instance, while looking after the people who matter. And keeping their taxes down.

      • He may think he can, or should try : the social conservatives think they have all the right and the wisdom, and holy writ to back it up. He will certainly get pressure from Sanctimonious (George Pell).

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